AM I IN LOVE WITH MY MALE BESTFRIEND? | EP 20 | SEASON FINALE

Donald, are you my friend? Yes. Do you want to f me? I think we're a very different wavelength. You're a friend. Do you believe that middle and female people can be platonic friends? You think a man wouldn't attempt to be friends with a girl that he's not attracted to? Do you think you're better than women? Hey! Whoa! There's a reason why boyfriends tell their girlfriends to watch for their guy friends. It's not part of knowing that it's experience. For the most part, guys aren't really friends with women in relationships. The opportunists waiting for their turn. Having those conversations in New York. When you have a man who does not know how to communicate, the best way to engage in that is to find a use for the relationship. It's true. Like, think about it. Men won't women for something. The same way women won't look. Friendships are like that. It's not weak or gay to talk about your feelings. I don't agree with you. Tell me why you don't agree. Welcome to Amai Tulao, the podcast. Hey, guys. Welcome back to Amai Tulao, the podcast. It's Sophie, aka the Audity. I am interrupting today's episode, episode 20 of Amai Tulao, with some very sad news. Sad, such like, just like some news that I wanted to share because when we recorded the episode, we did not know that this was going to be the last episode. But now that we do, I wanted to make sure we spoke to you guys directly before we closed out this chapter. So, I wanted to let you know that this is the final episode of Amai Tulao, the podcast. It's Sophie aka the Audity. I don't want to say it's the last episode ever of the podcast. I think there's a lot of potential for this podcast to be 20 times bigger than it is currently. We're just going to be taking a break while we work on a lot of things internally. We're going to be active across socials. We're going to be active everywhere else. Just not posting any new episodes for now. So, I want to let you guys know that. We've done 20 incredible episodes. I have poured my heart, my life, my soul into this podcast with me and Donald over the past couple of months. It's been a dream of mine to have my own podcast for like three or four years. And this was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do. And we've just been doing it ourselves. It's been me and Donald doing this in my apartment on my green couch. And I am just really grateful for the pod fam for always showing up and showing us love. So, I wanted to let you guys know that. Don't know that any thoughts before they start the episode. So, this is so traumatic. I don't know. I think it's bitter sweet. Yeah. I think because we know what's happening. Yeah. I think it's just bitter sweet. That's what I have to say. Okay. Yeah, guys, I love you so much. I am so grateful. I don't know what else to say. I love you. Thank you. Shear the podcast. We're going to have all our episodes live and they're going to be living on YouTube and in Spotify and everything. So, you can really listen to the old episodes. Share it on stories. Make some noise about the podcast if you really loved it. And hopefully, we'll be back soon. Stay tuned on all our socials. If we're coming back, when we're coming back, we're going to let you guys know first. We promise. Yeah. Enjoy the episode. This coming out. It's about friendship and Donald's relationship is very chaotic and it's very fun to record. So, I think that's going to be a fun final episode that you guys would enjoy. So, I'm glad to record it. I love you guys very much. And this is Sophie and Donald signing out. That is my favorite episode on the comments. Oh, yeah. That's also my favorite episode. And the comments. If you're seeing this on Instagram or anyone else, let's think of a big episode. Ever of the podcast. I would love to know that. I hate my guys. Donald, I think that the reason why female friendships are considered messier or messy or intense or terrible or more dramatic is because women share more and emote more within their relationships than masculine or male relationships. So, men don't talk to each other. There's no need for problems. Women talk to each other and problems occur. Do you agree or disagree with that? I'm in the middle. Really? Well, we'll talk about it in this episode. Hey, guys. Welcome back to my to love the podcast. Sophie, aka the oddity. And my co-host, Mr. Donald. Today's episode based on the odd take at the beginning. Maybe it's odd. Maybe it's not. Let me know in the comments. It's about friendships, not female friendships but friendships in general. And I feel like we're going to definitely end up talking about female friendships, male friendships, male and female friendships, because as you guys know, me and Donald are pretty good friends. I consider him my best friend. He sings, he's fake a s*t and doesn't think he's my best friend because apparently I have like six best friends. So, no one wants to be my best friend because I have too many best friends. But if everybody doesn't want to be my best friend because I have too many best friends then who is my best friend? I'm sure I do consider your best friend. It's still family. Yeah. Oh, my best friend. Who is your best friend? I'm telling you every time, like you tell me, let me tell you all the story real quick. Last week, I called Donald, Donald is in the streets of Manhattan. I live in Manhattan. Donald doesn't have any plans to see me. So why the st are you in the city? So Donald is like, oh, I'm under, I'm heading out to go see a friend. Who? Who is this friend? Why don't I know them? And then he mentioned some, some name, some shin. Who's shin? I've known Donald for three years. I've never heard of shin in my life. But all of a sudden, he wants to visit Manhattan and go see shin. That's what I mean by you fake a st. Hey, forget that I went to college. That's even worse. That means you have a whole community. And you don't want to pull me into your community as your best friend. You're not a good friend to me. Donald, you're not a good friend to me. That is very factual. When last year, you invited me over to your house for dinner. And you know your girl cooks. Have you ever invited me out to dinner? Have you ever invited me to hang out with you? No, you haven't. No, you have not. Every single weekend, past two months. You always want us to work or run. That's not true. That's true. I've never said, you know what? Come hang out. Let's watch TV together. Let's go to the s*t in the movies. You've never said that. Yes, because it was work. We'll discuss this in this episode. Anyway, guys. We're talking about all things friendships. Our growing friendships. Dealing with my little female friends, making friends of your 20s, friends getting married, friends moving. All things friendships. Donald, are you my friend? Yes. Do you want to f**k me? Sophie, are you my friends? Yes. You want to have breakfast with me? No. Donald, can you be platonic friends with Sophie? Yes. Kate, do you believe that middle and female people can be platonic friends? Right, I was going to say the same thing too. Why? Okay. Tell us. What do you think? No, I'm listening. Why are you... I feel like I don't like this pattern. You're putting up the spot first. I don't do that. That's not fair. You're putting me here. I never do that. I'm an angel. Okay. I'm listening. I think... Yes. No. Okay. You can't take the middle. You have to have a straight answer. Okay. I think it depends. It depends because it's not easy, right? Okay. It's not easy. And friendship is very hard. And I think the level of understanding exists between the guy and the girl. It needs to be there. They need to be communicating at the highest level. Sometimes you have friends, but you're friends in certain moments. You're not really communicating all around. The hard times are good times. They're your friend, but you're your best friend. I feel like a guy and a girl can be best friends. I don't think they can just be casual friends. I actually think it's the opposite. No. Because to be someone's best friend, like for example, both of us. Yeah. I feel like we don't count. Because our relationship also is very, very big on work. Best is like actual friendships. Exactly. Okay, let me give you my argument. Okay. I don't think men and women can be friends. I don't think they can be platonic friends. I think they can only be platonic friends if they knew each other from when they were younger. Ah. I really think so. Because think about it. It's harder to bridge a gap where like, how do you meet new people if you're older? Let's say from 21, also from college, because college is different. If you're in controlled environments, it's easier to make friends with a guy. If I was in college, I had a bunch of male friends. Right? It's just all in control. You're in high school and in class all those things. When you're outside in the world, it's much harder because where are the things that connect you to the person? You have to be very intentional about that. And most of the time, when you meet someone of the opposite sex who is like a friend or where I'm like, I'm interested in painting. So I go to a painting class and see a guy there. I am very rarely thinking, oh, I want to make friends with this guy because he likes painting too. For the most part, you are thinking romantically, sexually, partner, really. Not necessarily. What do you want to be the best friends? I want to be the best friends. Kaviyat. If you find the person attractive. Because that's a big thing. So how many women do you know are friends with attractive men? That the men are straight. Yes. Yes, that's a huge factor, of course. Huge. Right, right. And the conversation really makes sense. Right, right, right. Okay. It's what I mean. It's the argument there. And right now, if I look around the men in my life, most of them who I am friends with, I've either had something to do with, and then we went past that. Like we messed around, did whatever, and then we realized, okay, like it's whatever we're just friends. Or they're waiting for their time. If I say, all right, come on. Let's, let's mess around this. I'll say, they will say yes. Like there's still some level of interest there. Because it doesn't hurt. Very few men would say, nah, it's fine. I want to keep the friendship. Yeah, of course there's no painful. What did you say? Of course. There's no wall. Painful. What's painful? That's what you just said. What did I say? It's not hard for questions to happen. Like it's not difficult. But why would you use painful? I made it hard in terms of like... And I meant painful in terms of heart. Heartaches are painful. No. To be hard is to be painful. To be soft is to be easy. No. Let's talk to you. I think we're a very different wavelength. You will say. The point is, I don't think they can be. Especially platonically, especially if they attract us to each other. I don't believe so. So let's move on. The women in your life. Yes. Are there any women in your life right now that are not your siblings? That you are a better accept from me. As someone you work with. Because Donald worked with all women. What does I say about him? He's a great guy. That you're friends with. No. But yes. Right. Yeah. I have a lot of friends who we have shared interest, right? So like runners, people that do... They don't have a partner. Like single women. Yes. I do think like men and women can be friends. They just need to be a shared interest. Well I feel like that's what friendships should all be in general. Male and female. I just think that how we raised, right? It says a lot about what our future looks like. Of course. Of course. Growing up, if a girl is playing with the boys, she's fast. If a boy is playing with the girls, you are too girly. Go play with just boys. Go play with just girls. Right. And then you grow up. And then you're in school. And the boys go play with themselves. The girls go play with themselves. Not like that. But like you get the point. Basically, right. And then you go to college. I think it's a secondary school high school. And uni is when you're able to intermingle. And usually because you've been raised to not interact. For the most part, by the time you are interacting, it's often from a, I don't know who this person is. I don't know what these specimens, I want you specimens then, are. I want to figure them out. Right. So you see there's like a notion of curiosity with men and women. So it's oftentimes not platonic. Right. Like, think about it from high school when you're in boarding school or something. And like, it was go visit the girls for the first time. You're not thinking, I want to be that girl's friend. You're thinking, oh, I want to mess around. I want to do a kiss. I want to, you know what I mean? Like, you're oftentimes thinking sexually because that's really what society says. Do you want to set off with your friend? Oh, you know what I mean? Like, as you should the conversation. And then when you're in college, it typically is like, okay, this is the first time. And you hear this story a lot, even in American college, where people go crazy. Because that's the first time out of the house. They're not with their friends anymore. They're not this, they're not that able to explore. So that exploratory time comes in. And then you graduate from college or you finish school, you're working. That's usually when you're looking for a partner, you can for a person to like, unless you're like, no, interested in that kind of thing. It's oftentimes hard to figure out and say, you know what? I want to intentionally make friends with opposite sex. Now, I will also argue and say, I wish more men and women intermingles platonically. Right? But I think society has sexualized women so much and have made that divide so intentional. Yeah, for sure. But I think more so women as a guy, unless you're like toxic, toxic masculinity is involved. As a guy, if you're friends with a girl, you're usually just helping her. Or you're like, you're dying. So you're being supportive. As a woman, if you're hanging out with guys, you're fast. Or you're definitely having sex. Because a young age is a girl. So society oftentimes already brings that gap into the conversation. So it's oftentimes then harder to then try to bridge that as we're getting older. You know what I mean? Like, unless you have a brother or sister. Because if you're an only kid, that's been a different scenario in the first place. Because like, for example, my brother is 10 years older than me. So me and my brother, we had that relationship where like, I'm able to be friends with guys. Because for the most part, I just always hung out with guys. And then I always had this thing as a kid that I really wanted female friends. Because I was always just hanging out with my brother and his cousins and his friends. And I wanted the idea of a female friendship and the girlhood. And Hannah Montana and Lily, her best friend, or these powerful girls type of thing. And that led me down the rabbit hole of like, terrible friendships in general. You do have a problem with that. I do. No. I don't. You're the best friends. You remember when I was in, like, together. I remember when I was in all, like, I actually, like, they're like my infinity stones that I picked up. I'm different, like, points in my life. I'm grateful for them, for sure. But definitely, like, as a kid growing up, friendships to me, I think just looks differently. Okay. Yeah. How do they meet? Let's say I see that instance, right? Friends who tune a girl in a guy. Mm-hmm. How do they meet? Right. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. It's hard for them to be still in their friends. Because how are they meeting? Okay. Let me give you an example. Okay. I've had times when I was single where I would connect with like people, right? Some connected girls would have things in common. But I genuinely do not want anything from them. Mm-hmm. But the girls are falling for you something like that. Yeah. Let's talk about that real quick. Again, society. Because we're going to blame society for a lot of things every time. And we perpetrate society. So, like, this is all our faults. Sometimes, not all the time, we tend to mistake kindness, affection, intention, interaction with attraction. Right? If you're constantly told a man who provides for you or cares about you, supports you, is interested in you, you are going to think they're interested in you from more than just friendship. Right? Unless you are otherwise told something else. And even from a guy's perspective, right? How many times have I been so friendly? And the guys, like, I thought you were flirting with me and I'm like, I'm not flirting. I was just being nice, right? Like, it happens on both sides of the aisle. Again, that's why I reiterate that I don't think men and women can be best friends. Or, like, platonic friends, unless they're not attracted to each other. Or they just don't feed into the attraction. But there's always going to be an underlying attraction there. Okay. Oh, God. Do you think you're smart-king? No, no. Because, like, do you think I... Because you know what to mean on the attraction? Okay. You think a man wouldn't attempt to be friends with a girl that he's not attracted to. Yeah. I think so. Okay. You argue, and this is not all people, you make friends for a purpose. You just don't make friends, right? Like, that's my biggest thing. Like, with friendships, like, sidebar. That's why I always get so confused about why people wear romantic relationships more than friendships. Yeah. Because, on the base level, they aren't typically the same, right? Sometimes, a friendship is actually... Even more important to you than a romantic relationship. Because a romantic relationship just has... It's the same culture. This is a lot of important, yeah. Oh, my God. That's true. We are so aligned. If you're listening into this, I just... When it's a hugged on all the clothes, he's so right. We could talk about that for hours. Okay. But let's continue talking about this. For me, for that instance, usually when a man is that, it's simply because they want something from the person. Right. I could be access, I could be intention, it could be whatever it is, but usually that's the reason why. And I think vice versa, right? A woman wants it to be friends with a man and not wanting anything else. Like, I know why I'm friends with them, guys. Because, oh, like, you can help me do this, right? Which, again, the platonic part comes in. And then it gets modded oftentimes by attraction. Because also when it happens, human nature, you try to do what you attracted to and the person that... It happens that way. So, I say all that to say, have you ever been in a situation like that that go messy? Tell me the story. Ooh, okay. The messiest one. Yeah. I could actually read the DM. No. No? Yes. Wait, are you gonna read it? Yeah. Here it, raise it. I read the DM. Let's see. Okay. I'm in the world. Right. A couple of years ago, I met this friend and she was in like New York for a period of time. And she was about to leave. Right? I met her through another friend. She was about to leave. I think she was like going somewhere in like Europe for like the work. And she was leaving America. So, being nice, I was like, oh, you know what? You were doing a picnic. I'm gonna come. I came for the picnic. When they were with friends. It was chill. She said she was trying to get a job. I introduced her to someone who probably... So, you helped a lot. Yeah, I helped a lot. I was like being supportive. Were you attracted to her? No, actually. This was like a straight friendship thing. And... Where is she from? She's from France. Okay. Honestly, that country. That country. And so do you say gay? They don't like French women, guys. No. Oh, no. He doesn't. He doesn't have a relationship. But it was interesting because I'm like chilling in my bed. Are you really searching for the DM right now? No, I have it open right now. It was so quick. Right. And I received the DM. And I was so shocked. Right. This was 12-13 a.m. It says, This is random. I should probably not say, but I'm grateful I met you. I don't know you very well. But you seem like a very kind, warm, smart, genuine, generous person. Everything you have managed to achieve is very impressive. And the life that you'll be in for yourself is enviable. And I stayed here longer. I would have loved to get to know you more. I guess I'm looking into you. Don't get this cringey out. Hope is okay that I said that. Good night. Oh, how did you fing respond, Donald? Oh, Donald. Oh, Donald. Oh, Donald. Donald. What did you say to that poor girl? I didn't respond. Who? You said lie. You did not respond. Were you single? Yes. Was she ugly? It doesn't matter. I was just wickedness. It's one of those things I have realized when I saw, when I look back. When a woman is interested in me, snoring was exciting for me. Right? I'm locked up with guys. If I'm interested in someone, they spark my curiosity. I'm going for it. That's really where my attraction lies. Not in the reverse. Do you think you're better than women? Whoa! No, no, by don't. I don't know why. I don't know why. I feel like I think you think you're better than women. What? Let me explain. Let me unpack. What? I don't. Because why you just communicated to me now is she was not worth my time. That's not true. Yes, because you did not treat her like a human being. Right, and I was bad. You don't know. I know that at the base level. No, no, no. I'm saying now you're a better man. Now you talk. Then, I know what I'm saying. Yes. Then. Because what you just said right now is when women were pursuing you at that point, and I think that's where the power dynamic comes into play. Right. When they're pursuing you at that time, don't know you're at pissed off. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared. No, because it's also, I'm you're learning. I'm also hearing it's out loud. As you said it, and I get it because as you're talking, I was like, this is how a lot of men talk. Because again, the power is typically in the man's hand. The patriarchy works that way to wear like even her shooting her shot in that way. She was very nervous because of course he's not going to respond and that's going to drive her crazy. But again, that's why I said it's really hard for women and men to be platonic friends unless they're seeking something. Because I don't understand a woman who would choose actively to be friends with a woman. Because that's a lot of work you have to do to have to teach a man to unlearn a lot of the things that he's been taught from a really young age. Because a lot of men don't respect women to begin with. And this is not even me. This is not happening. This is facts. Men are raised to respect women. They're raised to think they're better than women. Because then women are supposed to be subservient to them. Which again, is absolutely false. So in this conversation that you're talking, when you were speaking, I don't unintentionally, you were like, yeah, unless I want to chase after. I'm not going to engage. But in that scenario, a simple, oh my, I was just being a good friend. I'm not really interested in you. And of course, if you listen to this and you're a really young or you're a guy or girl, whatever, you're interested, it's just understanding how to play that situation. It makes sense to be like, hey, I'm so sorry. I'm really not that interested in you. However, you're a good friend. If this is terrible friend zoning, like, I'm so sorry. When you're coming out, I'll give you dinner. You know what I mean? Like, soften the blow of rejection. Of course. I know for a fact, you're also like the goaster, right? Yeah, that's. Yeah. And again, that also comes from a lot of people not having the emotional bandwidth to actually understand compensation. It made you uncomfortable. Right. But also that's because like, you didn't grow up navigating the emotions that come with womanhood and growth. Right. Women don't grow up understanding how growing up as a man or as a man works in this situation. We just don't, we don't grow up learning about each other. You also know constantly thinking about the other person. Yeah. Because it's like ghosting things for me. It's like, you know, if people were to come out and say, oh, this woman is like, I will ghost you. I never ghosted people. Oh, my God. I'm the over communicator. I'm the one who's going to explain to you exactly what happened and why it happened because of this happened. That's exactly why I did. I feel like I have to over explain to not hurt your feelings. I would say I think that's one thing that I'm definitely benefited from our friendship. Yeah. Yeah. It's like learning how to like, don't communicate and like, because when we first became friends, oh, you know what I'm saying. I used to call it out all the fucking time. Like I used to force this man to talk. And you know what I'm doing is because it's like, I would get you just like. Just requires. He zones out. He don't live this zone out. Like he's looking at you but he's not. Like he's over the conversation. Like he's just like, can I be done? And I'm always like, no. You're going to sit here. You're going to listen. No. That's true. I can see that. You want to read this. Read this conversation. Oh, yes. We've been going into Reddit to get more stuff for you guys. So this Reddit conversation under casual conversation says, having a platonic female friend is one of the best things that happened to me. I'm a straight guy by I met this female friend a while ago and I got to say it's one of the best things ever. Unlike most of my male friends, we talk about our feelings and we give emotional support to each other. She tells me she loves me all the time. I just feel like warm talking to her. It's so good to have someone like this as long as you can move past any jealousy or romantic intentions. This is a response to that thing. I'm a straight woman who somehow has almost all many of my friends who are right now. Don't get me wrong. I treasure all my friends where I really miss the way we've been expressed friends. She does feel quite different. Not to mention it can sometimes feel like work to teach boys how to talk about their feelings. What we talked about or being the only one in the group willing to give them space to express emotions. Add only female friends who are so long that I didn't realize how much men don't check up on each other emotionally. Take care of each other guys. Okay. So go ahead. Just pick up this. I think that's one thing I learned by having, because I do, even though they work relationships, I do talk to a lot of women. Even in those work relationships, there's a lot of like interpersonal things that I also had to learn. It's like knowing how important birthdays are, knowing how to check up on people like. Also, or call. Pulling back from last week's conversation about masculine and feminine energy. This is huge on that. I tell you this a lot. Your ability to be intentional, inquisitive, and compassionate stems from your willingness to allow yourself to sit in your feminine energy. And reach across the pond, essentially, to mingle and interact with women. And you hear this a lot, because I see a lot of women who are like, and this is not even saying it's about, no, I scratch that all y'all. When you have all female friends, no male friends at all. Transparingly, most of the time, if it's not balance of feminine energy within that circle, it can be exhausting. Because you hear this a lot. And you see that we're here talking about. Because again, what you hear from a lot of female friends is always very emotional. But essentially emotional is just there's a space where the emotions are able to be communicated freely. So you're able to lean on each other to process it. Because the world is a very scary place for women. Now with men, they don't have that. So imagine groups of people and everybody in between that I always try to make my language like acceptable for everybody. So that way people can follow along. That's why I keep trying to say in between. So it makes sense. If you have only female friends, you're very emotional. And you have all men here who have all male friends, no emotions at all. The beauty of feminine and masculine energy is should interact. Because that's what y'all come in, right? So more men need to have more platonic female friends. Or just be open to speaking to the opposite gender and getting advice and navigating what the emotions are. And talking to each other. Because the thing now isn't necessarily that men need to be friends with women. It's men need to just learn to express their emotion and tap into that feminine energy. We talked about last episode. So we also express the passion, intuition. Like being able to look and be passive and understanding. Like it's not weak or gay to talk about your feelings. Because the rate of male suicide is huge because men don't f talk. And human nature isn't equipped with like a block of emotion. Like you should not always block your emotions out essentially. So this is another point, right? Speak up for what the guy said about a straight guy. But he has a female friend. What happens when he's in a relationship? Oh, I saw something about this, right? Yeah, never like before the next one. In that first one, right? The straight guy who has this female friend, that emotional support. So I can talk about that because I'm the girly in the situation. I'm a sexy, moral fing. I'm a bad bitch. I am so intentional about my friendships with men who are with their partners, who are with women essentially. Because I understand, especially because of the way I speak, like I'm very, very open and I'm very out there. And all my male friendships, if they have a partner, she's my friend too. Honestly, almost times I actually become her friend more than I become his friend because I support women's rights and wrongs. But that's really how I navigate it, right? It never makes sense to me that if a friend of mine, a guy in the sense, gets a girl that I'm expecting the girl to reach out to me or none of that. That's too much of a lie. Instead, I want to show her it is safe here because I am safe and I am your friend too. And I always struggle with men oftentimes who hide their female best friends and say, oh, maybe she doesn't want to talk now. If someone is a huge part of your life, it makes no sense that you're sick. It makes another cannot be friends with them. And it's always been a red flag because even in my recent relationship, where I went through a necessarily relationship or whatever it was I was in, the person had a best friend or has a best friend, someone really, really close. And it always just nodded at me that like they kept us separate because it made no sense to me. If this is somebody who is really, really close to you and I'm really close to you, we should mingle. We should be friends because at the end of the day, you are the anchor and our friendship and your friendship. If your friendship is important to me and if our love is important to each other, it makes sense that we are acquainted. I never and I don't respect relationships that tend to alienate the best friends or say like, oh my god, I have the idea of like, oh my god, I can't have a female best friend. Oftentimes stem from the fact that usually the both parties, the best friend and the guy or vice versa, don't communicate effectively or don't try to open the relationship to accommodate the person or the new person coming in. That was a very long-winded answer of saying, just talk to the friend. Because I'm really close to your girlfriend. Well, I want to say close, but I'm really, I'm friends with your girlfriend. And like, we text and like, she watches my dog from me, like, I've met her several times. Like, we've planned events to get out. I wanted to make sure I built that friendship. And I think one of my closest friends to his money wells and money wells had a relationship and again, same thing. I mean, still her from him in that situation too. Like, yeah, I've just always been very intentional about that because it makes sense. And usually, it doesn't always oftentimes work out when the guy has something to hide. Where? Yeah, or the girl, honestly, at this point. I think also, I find it extremely exhausting with my male friends. Yeah. Right, because now that I have a little bit of context, and this is maybe like me understanding a little bit what it means like exists with like that family energy of like, have that knowledge. Where I try so much with my male friends to like, checking on them and like, make sure they're good. You get it and say what they don't do it. And this year, in particular, one of my big stands, right? And it's very selfish is that I'm not, I'm not going to try. Yeah. Because for the past three years, I have been trying. But like, I can see you getting in your way. And it's, it's really exhausting to get a man to like, rise to the occasion. Like, it's the hardest. Even for myself, like, it's the hardest. Yeah. And when you're trying to do it across board, so like, how do you think like a guy should navigate, you know, because, and that's a done nothing with bloodlines, right? Like you, because you're mostly going to get that emotional support from talking to a girl. Yeah. Right? It's like, you're, but that's the thing. I feel like that's such a disappointing way to look at things. Because I know it's the reality though. And this, this is for me. Yeah. Who I get, like for example, when I talk to my dad, you have great conversation. Yeah. I do get emotional support. Yeah. But it's not just those moments. It's something special in between. Yeah. Like, I see. I see. I see. You're right. You're right. You're right. I think my guy friends can go two months. And same with me. I can go two months without talking to my dad. Talk to you for seven times a day. You're just about me. But like the friends that have, like, they're checking in, they're like, oh, I hope you've had, and I've tried it with my male friends. It's empathy. But with men, it's not sustainable. And I want to, I've seen this like, for example, with like, in Mano, for example, it is like, well, in Mano, there's also a group on the scene. You're not, also like. You're not. Mano also has a bunch, like, very heavy family energy. Exactly. Yeah. For us, like, we get it. It also makes you all pretty successful. Like, my ex was someone who I loved his relationship with his friends because they talked a lot. And you can see how successful they all were because of the conversations they had with each other. Right. And how much they grew up together in a sense. And again, like, it's not a woman's job to tell men what to do. Right. And I don't know how to shift the tide on toxic masculinity. Either way, men need to just take more accountability on like maintaining better friendships. And I think the world would be a better place if more men opened up about their feelings because feelings aren't natural and normal. And it's not something to be scared about. Okay. All right. There's another thing, a reaction from Reddit talking about this whole like, am I the asshole for any in an eight-year friendship over my boyfriend? Okay. I'm so curious. Myself, 21 female, I've had a friend since high school, we'll call him Kevin, 21 male. To give some background, we met in class and never really noticed him, unless he was trying to annoy me. We got put in a group project and started talking. Valentine's Day rolls around, he got me a gift in front of the whole class. I made the comments whole thanks, but it tried to be nice, but not even on. It took me by surprise. We talked and he said it because stay friends and it would get over the crush. During COVID became pretty close. He's finally turned into my second family spending holidays at the South. During this time we both had relationships. Him and Sarah's girlfriend and I casually dated even two of his friends. I thought it was over the crush because if not, he would've said something about me dating his friends. He never did. I eventually started dating my now boyfriend, we'll call him Mike, and I suddenly knew it would be serious. During this time, Kevin and I drifted. He was going through with his girlfriend, pretty editing on him and Mike's and I had a relationship. We found out I was pregnant. Besides, I kept the baby and we were happy. I called to tell Kevin and he said I look like he hopes it works out, but if not, he'll help me raise the baby. It was a weird comment, after I didn't hear from him for nine months. Mike always said that, Kevin was probably in love with me, but I genuinely thought it was brother, sister, love, nothing ever happened between us. Kevin didn't even currently at me after my daughter was born. But a couple of months after I had the baby, he started texting me out of the blue, acting like nothing changed. Mike had no problem with him texting me here and there but not to hang out with him by myself. Also, Kevin started saying he loved me and making weird comments about Mike. I ignored the comments for a while. When I said we couldn't be friends anymore, he sends a long goodbye message, calling me pet names and saying he would always love me. I ignored it. It sent me a tick-tock saying the same. I ignored it. Eventually, Mike tested Kevin, telling him he thought it was disrespectful to check another guy's girl that he loved her. They got into it, it wasn't going anywhere, so Mike just left it alone. Kevin kept texting me, so I blocked him. Then we found a different app to text me, so I blocked him on all of them. I felt bad, but this was affecting my family. Now I've heard from Mike, which was like he's pissed. I'm a bitch, and I ended up our eight-year friendship with some guy. But he's just some guy to me. He's the father of my child and the person I want to marry. As long as he's short, I might ask for any of the eight-year friendship with my boyfriend. First of all, this is wrong, because it's not eight-year friendship. There were never friends. Yeah, there were never friends. Right? If your friendship is based off of you kind of knowing that a man has a crush on you and you're able to just getting what you want of the relationship, you're not being honest from the beginning about what your feelings are in the first place, so you're not friends. So it makes sense that it's going to end up that way. You're not the asshole for that, because it makes sense. He's the asshole. Yeah, and I feel like, in cases like that, I think both of them are at fault, because I don't think they're communicating effectively on what the relationship is. In many ways, from the beginning, from the moment he gave you a Valentine's Day card, girl, now you know. It's hard to say I'm able to be friends with a man who has expressed interest in me prior, because there's always going to be that underlying thing there in the first place, unless you're both in equally successful relationships. Does that make sense? So like, in our case, she found a husband and she has a child. For her, she's a successful relationship. If he had a partner, I don't think he would be that pressed. I think the relationship, you've got to say that. No, no, I'm just saying that. I think the relationship lasted as much as he did, because he had a person, she had a person. It was becoming rocky when he didn't have a person, and she probably would depend on him more, when she didn't have a person. That, because we are in friendships, you depend on the other person when you're lacking in something and vice versa. So that's the thing they are just both egging each other on until one of them finally cracked, and in this case, it was Kevin. So I'm not going to say poor Kevin, because he doesn't deserve it. You don't think he deserves it? No, he doesn't. Poor Kevin. He should leave the woman and look on the child. Anyways, we have another Reddit situation here. I'm going to read, How do men feel about platonic friendships with women? 25 female, I've been thinking a lot about whether men and women can truly be platonic friends with our romantic feelings interfering. In my own experience, I've had male friends who at some point ended up developing feelings for me. I don't know why maybe they need glasses. Okay, well, it may be wonder if it's inevitable or just a coincidence. Do you think men and women can generally be just friends without any romantic complications? Have you ever had long term purely platonic friendships with women? And what do you think made them work? Or is it always a risk that one side will catch feelings? What do you think, Donald? This is for you. No, this is for you. Do you think men and women can generally be friends? Have you ever had long term platonic relationship with women? It's talking about, talking to a man. Who? Who? Who? That's like an owl. Who? I have a couple of friends in... Niger. You've not seen them. Yeah, I have. That can't count. What if one were in Niger, right? You were young. You're not grown now. Sorry, I'm just... No, no, I didn't see young. What else in university? Yeah, it was not. You're still young. True. Yeah, it was like you were in... Like outside of, again, a controlled environment. Yeah, but the truth is, we weren't friends. Exactly. That's what she's saying. Like, can you say generally with me friends? Honestly? Honestly? Yes. Right? Because my ex's best friend, I'm really, really close to now. And it's generally a platonic relationship. Like, we call, we chitchat, we talk. And there's nothing going on. Right. But I will say, it often times works out when the person is a taboo. Like, I'm never going to date my ex's best friend. So it's much easier, and it's a comfortable relationship because you can trust that the other side can't catch feelings. So you feel safe. Doesn't really matter. Exactly. Yeah. Well, you would know. I don't think so. People cheat, even in marriages. True. Yeah, it's not everything that matters. I honestly don't think so. I think it's far-fetched. Of course, there's no absolute in the world, right? What is platonic, right? It's like, are you talking everyday? No, because the friendship is with I have that. I'm not talking to them every day. Okay. But so, of course, you can have a female friend. But in this situation, we're definitely talking about a genuinely good long term friend that you can depend on. Yeah, I think that's possible. I also just think that there's always going to be boundaries set. I'm not going to bed on the phone with my boy best friend. We're not falling asleep on the phone. We're not hanging out and holding hands. We're not going to dinner. You know what I mean? We're not doing those things. And funny enough, my ex. And this is, I don't know why he's a good example of this because he has a lot of female friends. And there's all platonic. I still get calls to this day. How does he have these many friends? And it was never an issue in our relationship because the friends always just made sure I was included. But also, he had such intentional boundaries with them that they just knew what was up. And when they always crossed the boundary, he was always very quick to set those boundaries. So I think a lot of times these relationships just don't work out because there is no boundaries set. Essentially. Yeah. Let's see some of the answers here. Their answers? Yeah. Oh! Okay, one answer says, build 1975 says, it's impossible to turn off nature. Okay. When hormones start to form, there isn't much that you can do but create a little distance. Other than that, I wouldn't know why men and women wouldn't be able to just be friends. Friendship is based on other things than sexual attraction. That is true. Again, also boundaries come from. If you're mistaking care and support for love or affection, it makes sense for you to pull back, regulate, and then come back. And even in like female friendships, there are times where you get overwhelmed. Maybe this person is frustrating you or this and that. It's oftentimes a good way to pull back. Take a step back. We calibrate, regulate, and then come back into the relationship. I think we all need to learn boundaries and space in friendships and relationships in general. I think romantic relationships, people ask for space, people get really scared and terrified. But then I always say, let's talk about this Donald. Me and Donald had a fight, right? And we did not talk for how long. It was six months. Five months. Right? And I think we needed that space to be stronger friends. That's true. I don't think we would have been, so essentially don't hurt me real bad. And I just knew that for us to go past that hurt and just for us to deal with it, we needed a space. But I was so sure that if we were meant to be friends, we'll come back to each other. And we ended up doing it five months. I think a lot of times, even in romantic relationships, people get too scared to lose the other person. They don't want to take the risk of putting that space in. But if you're scared that someone is going to lose interest in you because you stop talking for five months, six months, whatever, I don't think you should be friends in the first place. Because that relationship is not strong enough to withstand anything. The idea that you need to be up under someone, whatever that person is to you, doesn't necessarily appeal to me. Right. It's like the string that you're holding on to is not strong enough. Yes, it's not strong enough. And it can be, and it should be. Essentially, relationships should be ebb and flow. They're not easy. Relationships are not easy. I like that. Next answer. I find myself uncomfortable around women who clearly just want to be friends because I have honestly never had to deal with such a situation before. I enjoy their company, but don't always know what to talk about. I'm so used to just having friendships with men. This is from someone called man made margarine. That makes sense. That was me. You're a man made margarine. That was me. Wait, before you say it, a response to that is a male man whose name is ever vigilant one. The reason you find yourself uncomfortable around women who clearly just want to be friends is that women don't tend to want male friends. They want male appliances and tools. They want to have those men available for their use when they need them. Otherwise, they have no want or use for the men they call their friends. That's a different angle. That's not wrong. Old. And then man made margarine response. You're not understanding it. We're both autistic. But she has the yapping uh-uh. What? She has the yapping without caring. Whether the other is interested in the variance, I have the silent momentarily where everything is happening in the room all at once kind. I enjoy listening to yap, bomb, two focuss, and everything all at once. So it just becomes overwhelming when things are jokes or not. I have fun life with the wrong woman. So this is a whole different conversation in general that he's talking about. We're going to focus on the first two. I really read really fast. You guys, I'm so sorry. I'm a terrible. I read so fast. That's like margarine is going through. So margarine is just, I don't think it's a male and female thing. I think margarine just does not like the friend or like they just, they are communication styles is very different. But that's not the point. Let's talk about what every visually and one says. Women just want male friends who are appliances and tools. When you have a man who does not know how to communicate, the best way to engage in that is to find a tool like a useful relationship. It's true. Like think about it. Men want women for something the same way women want. Friendships are like that. I know a friend who, if I need to go out today, I know who to call. If I need some support, I know who to call. If I need some money, I know who to call. If I need someone to help me put up my TV. I don't, I don't, I don't fault women who do that. Because that's often times also like a means to an end. Like, okay, if I can't talk to you about my emotions, at least you're going to help me do something. Because I know like, there are times where I'm like, I need to take the trash out and I'm like, who's my guy friend here? Or if there's like a coach on the floor? I want to kill the black friend. Because like, I think men are generally useful. Yeah. If you can, no, it's like a, a two-in-a-number one. Yeah. I feel like I like the names or the description of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like a tool like something you're helpful. You kind of need to direct. Yes. Okay, let's go back to, let's go to another person's response. Mm-hmm. God, this question comes up so often. Yes, men and more than people who have been platonic friendships with women. I have many such with women who are objectively attractive, but who I've never had the slightest romantic sexual interest in. You're going against a bunch of guys in here saying, no, you definitely can't. Because that happens every time this question is asked. I just always feel kind of sorry for them. Many of the friendships that I have with both men and women stretch back at good 20 to 30 years, I told you. It's because they met them young. It's not even that it's impossible to have such friendship. It's normal. Thank you. I like not that guy 6 to 50. You think he is in church? What do you mean? Like, he has church friends? I'm not bad guy. Look, because if you're in church and you're in community. No, I mean that. I feel like it goes back to my earlier point that male and female friendships only tend to work when you've known the person from a really young age. Right. Because you're able to navigate learning them and how you meet them. Because friendships also are like how you meet. We already talk about making friends as an adult is really hard. Imagine then growing up being in your mid 20s and then trying to make friends. And you find some guy who like it's hard to communicate. Why would you be friends with that? You know what I mean? It's going to be harder for you to bridge that gap and be friends with that person who's not able to communicate with you. Because they just don't know how to be friends with you. Right. It's just a bit harder. But if you've known them for a while, it's much easier because then you have an excuse to stay around. Okay. You think someone can be friends. Patani friends would get ex. Yes. I agree. Yes. For sure. Yeah. I think it's easier to be friends when you've gone past that. Yes. Yes. Oh my god. Yes. I think 100%. That is true. Because I have like, I have access that I'm genuinely like friends with. Because I also feel like it's because human beings don't have control. Right. Right. Right. So we're raised again, going back to like how we raise. We're raised. Like the ideas like, you know, men and women, boy and girl, whatever. Like, you should like each other. You like the person that it is. It's not very really platonic. Right. Because again, the end goal in like the path of a human being is to get married and have children. Because you have organs. Yeah. Not even organs. It's just like the end goal we talked about is like, give birth, get married, go to school, then all those things. So in this scenario, as you're growing up, you're supposed to be finding a partner to marry and settle down with. Right. So very rarely are you able to think, oh, this is not a partner to settle down with. This is a friend. Because in society is mine. And oftentimes what you're told is, why are you wasting, why are you friends with the guy when you can't just do something. One of the guy friends that I have in my mom will be like, ah, you're not this in this person. Or you don't like this person. Why not? He's good for you. You know, I mean, like you're going to have those questions. So in that scenario, once you've gone past the, I like to say, Oh, Jiu-Ku-Ku-Ru, which is like the, oh, I just, let me just, let's have the sex. Let's do the sexual connection. Let's do the chemistry. Let's go past that. You tend to realize, after you're not, the clarity just becomes very clear. I'm very interested in analogy. Okay. Tell me. You're cooking a pot. Okay. And you put, and you realize that you don't like my gay assaults in the pot. Mm-hmm. Like, you don't like a certain spice. Mm-hmm. Well, you two like all the other things. Like, you like the needs. You like all those things. You know what? She's a very, very African analogy. But think about it, right? Yeah. Meaning that I keep dating the person. You kind of go on TikTok. People will be like, we need to take podcasts. You did it the person. Yeah. You like 60%. You know you can't, this is not your forever person. Exactly. It's much easier to be platonic friends. Right. Especially if both of you have mutually agreed that the relationship did not work out. It's oftentimes harder if one person is still in feelings or whatever. If it's a mutual agreement, that is true. Okay. We have another response. When such equates us as yes, close friends usually ends negatively or abruptly. That is, one has feelings for the other but the other does not. One gets into a LTR. Long term relationship. Mm-hmm. And the close friendship becomes inappropriate. How close is too close? Would you just hang out with a woman? Well, here's the thing though. Again, the issue with long term relationships and best friendships that are like of the opposite sex is because there's usually no communication. Yeah. A really, really terrible job of actually communicating and saying, hey, this is somebody who's important to me in my life. I want to still be friends with them because I think it is possible. This just needs to be better boundaries. Okay. So, um, dairy king 28 says, I've learned over the years that you can maintain friendships with women platonically from a safe emotional distance. Getting close to any of them and they don't like you like that is a recipe for disaster. Most of the time they would get into a relationship I will talk to you or hang with you less. Either because they decided to, or they took it or others considered your a threat. I haven't seen me several times. I want to point out this all so happens in female friendships. We're like, you gain the relationship and you just stop talking to the person less. I have a thought about that. Let's put a pause in it so we talk about female friendships in a different episode. Many women can be friends, but many guys will only approach a woman they don't work with or share in activities with because they find them attractive. If not getting to the name, it's best I could spark said attraction. There's a reason why boyfriends tell their girlfriends to watch for their guy friends. It's not part of the way it's experienced. Most part guys aren't really friends with women in relationships. The opportunist is waiting for their turn. Don't know what you think about that. And then before you answer, Daisy Delight responds, how would you stay at the safe emotional distance? And the original poster says, part of it has your own wants and needs over there is any at all times. That's no good friendship. Be friendly, but don't do anything that indicates you have a deeper relationship. Keep the relationship as a surface level as possible, temper your expectations. If she has a BF for us and for the love of God, don't hang out with her alone. I don't agree with you son. I don't either. Tell me why you don't agree. Because I think it's extremely subjective. I think it's subjective. I hate groupthink. That is frustrating to me. And I know when you say opinions and when I do this a lot, I'm trying to learn to be limited and of course I'm learning. I tend to generalize a law with statements, right? But this human interaction is so subjective. It's like one-on-one basis. However, one can argue that human interaction is subjective, but we also learn from the stories we tell each other. True. Right? So if the story that is being told is that men and women can't be friends, men and women can't be friends. That's what we'll tell ourselves over and over and over again. If the story becomes men and women should be friends, then again, the real story that becomes men and women should be friends. I think we tend to tell ourselves these stories for, honestly, just constantly divide us, right? Because again, like we said in the earlier one in the episode, a man who has a balance of male and female friends is a better, well-rounded person. A woman who has a balance of male and female friends is a much more well-rounded person, right? Because everyone needs to be able to recognize the other person. Now, again, these are all very binary things, right? Gender is fluid, all that stuff. But ideally, that's how life should be. Like you should want the balance. And the issue comes along when communication is broken, when boundaries are crossed, when people are just human and like make terrible decisions and mistakes, right? Like if you think your friends are someone and another person catches feelings, even in female relationship relationships, like relationships break, right? It's normal, too. Why do we attribute relationships breaking in female and male relationships are female and female is different, right? Because at the core of it, they're just humans who are figuring a life out. But we tend to just like weigh the female one, like girl to girl or male to male, very differently for some reason, which is, like, I don't understand that concept, yeah. What does it mean by the opportunities within their time? People talk about that a lot, like, because like, think about it. If you find a really cool check, who's like, who's dating someone, but you think she's really cool, it makes sense that you might be attracted to her, but she's like, oh, I have a boyfriend. I don't want to date. Logically, because you were attracted to her, you would wait till maybe they break up before you shoot your shot, right? That's what it typically is. Like, oftentimes it's, it manifests in male and female relationships. No, no, this is better good, right? The danger in this conversation is acting on your emotions, right? And a lack of respect for the other person's autonomy or decision, right? For example, Kevin and Mike, an old girl who posted the content. Kevin just didn't respect Mike's relationship and the girl's relationship with Mike and their child. Kevin just went for it, right? That to me is the problem. Like, why would you not respect your friend's decision? You're not a good friend, so in fact, it's not that men and women can't be good friends. It's you who are not a good friend to this person. That's not good friendship, because breaking her potential home that she's chosen. It's crazy, because you have feelings for her. It's something that's like, when female friendships happen, they're fighting. It's like, oh, the girl acts a certain way. It's not because all female friendships are bad. It's just that particular friend was not a good friend to the other person. And so we've definitely seen patterns of men just not being good friends to women or vice versa. And it's not because they just can't be friends. It's just because people don't have the boundaries. Which is why my original point of they can't be friends stands because people, especially most humans at this point, don't set boundaries. Well, they don't try to. Because boundary setting is hard. Like, for you to actively tell someone, no. Okay, so give me some tea. I was this guy I used to talk to. I didn't know JK. We've had sex once, right? And we're friendly before Flirty and Friendly. I knew there was something there, but whatever. We're friendly before. We have sex once. It was okay. I was like, I'm not interested anymore. I'm done, right? And so we just didn't, like, we didn't follow up. But then he circled back. And you can tell like he's still very much interested in pursuing the relationship. And I was like, oh, I'm not interested. I just want to be friends. And he couldn't wrap his head around. Me just being able to just be friends. And we had to actually have a sit down conversation where I literally broke it down. Like, these are the boundaries I now have that we need to set. If you're not interested in having these boundaries set or respecting these boundaries, you're out of my life. I don't think a lot enough people are willing to sacrifice a relationship by having those tough conversations. Because of course, you don't want to lose the person. You don't want to make things awkward. You don't want to make things uncomfortable. So you just let things happen. And then at the end of the day, you end up making things uncomfortable because again, you're saying, you know, you're not saying anything at all. Well, I think you just go. You can't see that. No, I'm just giving you an example. Yeah. It's like, because having those conversations is really hard. Yeah. Especially in the present. I don't know. Right? The thing like where society where like we do, we're very good at reflecting. We are. We reflect very well. But like, in the moment, I think I said, like, you have to check with yourself like every single time as you're making your decisions. How does this affect your other person? How does this affect me? It's not easy. Well, I think that's what friendship should be. So in conclusion, I think that men and women can be friends if their boundaries set if people respected because they should also treat friendships like normal friendships in general. I think men need more female friends in their life. I think women need more male friends in their life. I think men need to be friends with each other a lot more. I think it's important for male friends to actually talk and open up to each other. I think emotional intelligence, emotional conversations need to happen within the male to male ratio. I think men need to realize that they can create space and time. So I think like with a lot of my new friends, what I often see is like, because of the way society is and I do what they're constantly pushing about, like, they're trying to work hard sometimes in relationships. They forget to create space for themselves to have those conversations. Like, they don't want to. Because when those moments happen, but they're chasing their careers and they do know all these things, because like, they're trying to make sure they're not third year, they're not fourth year. So, yeah, I think knowing that you can create space and you have time to more time. That's one thing that women are very good at. Well, multitasking. Oh my god, would you talk about the male and female brain? Because you know, people talk about logic and the difference in how women operate. That would be when we have guests in the broadcast sometime soon. Wait on it. We're so interested in middle from our brain. Because we'll talk about it in the next episode. All right, guys. It's the end of today's episode. It was really fun. I feel like this was a really good episode. Don't forget we have a voicemail feature or a question feature on our website at mytulaw.com. If you guys go there and type in or like put in a voicemail, we're going to play at the end of every episode. Just to hear your thoughts. If you listen to this episode, send us your thoughts. Oh my god. If you listen to this episode, you really want to like share your opinions on something. Send us a voicemail. Comments too, of course, but also like send us a voicemail. Reading your comment in the voicemail, if anything. And then we can play on the episode for next week or something. And we just like interact. Because that way you can hear your voice and the podcast too. We love you very much. Thank you for watching. Thank you for listening. Thank you for sharing. Don't forget to like, comment, and subscribe. If you're listening to Spotify, we love you. Yeah, I'm really really excited for where the podcast is going to go. This is episode 20. It feels like it's been years. It's been 20 episodes. Don't know what we've been doing this for 20 episodes. Isn't that crazy? I'm really proud of us. It does not feel like 20 at all. But we love you guys. We'll see you in our next episode. Say bye Donald. Bye guys.